Pitching Mechanics: Madison Bumgarner

by Kyle Boddy on Sep 9, 2009 10:25 PM PDT in Pitching Mechanics Comment 16 comments

Madison Bumgarner reverse rotates significantly, shows the ball to CF, and blah blah no one reads these notes anyway.

Let's get one thing straight: Madison Bumgarner is one heckuva talent. Dave Allen over at Fangraphs already talked about his past and his PITCHf/x readouts from his September 8th start, so I'll let you mosey on over there to read more if you like.

Here's a sample pitch from Bumgarner:

Bumgarner_medium

People inevitably tend to compare Madison Bumgarner to Randy Johnson, so I found a clip in my database of Randy...

Allow me to list the ways in which they are different...

Madison Bumgarner:

Excessively reverse rotates his shoulders.
Takes a very large step across his body and lands extremely closed.
Has extreme gloveside flyout.

Randy Johnson:

Does not excessively reverse rotate his shoulders.
Steps more or less in line with the plate.
Has the best gloveside tight finish of any LHP I have in my database.

As a result of striding far too closed, Madison Bumgarner severely pulls his pitching arm across his body, which strains the pectoralis minor in addition to other anterior shoulder muscles. He also features severe arm recoil due in no small part to his poor followthrough.

Bumgarner's a great talent, but I feel that his steadily dropping velocity is not a fluke or necessarily a sign of a young pitcher reaching his limits - it could be due to steadily accumulating shoulder damage.

EDIT: Thanks to NoNameOnCard (Trip Somers) for proofreading this for me. Made two errors. E-1, mark it in the book.

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Having a little fun with the post button tonight Kyle?

Smoltz.

by vivaelpujols on Sep 9, 2009 10:34 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Nah.

Last month was super busy, so I’m just trying to catch up with some work while I still can.

d_f wrote the other post. I just made a FanShot and a Story today!

Webmaster of Driveline Mechanics
http://www.drivelinemechanics.com - An Unconventional Look at Scouting

by Kyle Boddy on Sep 9, 2009 10:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh yeah, for some reason I though you wrote the Porcello peice today

Smoltz.

by vivaelpujols on Sep 9, 2009 10:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

That was yesterday!

Also, I made a FanShot from work.

Webmaster of Driveline Mechanics
http://www.drivelinemechanics.com - An Unconventional Look at Scouting

by Kyle Boddy on Sep 9, 2009 10:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sort of reminds me of Jered Weaver.

"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus

by hazel on Sep 9, 2009 10:54 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Nice comparison.

Webmaster of Driveline Mechanics
http://www.drivelinemechanics.com - An Unconventional Look at Scouting

by Kyle Boddy on Sep 9, 2009 11:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Great Request Turnaround

thank you sir!

by mighty_triton626 on Sep 10, 2009 12:32 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

The one problem that I have with him is,

something you pointed out already, his landing extremely closed.

I would think it hard for him to locate his pitches, specifically his breaking ball, on the inside corner to a righty.

But I cannot disprove the fact that he is a great talent with some upside, I guess I would like to see that small move made to make him, IMO, a more effective pitcher.

ken korach's voice is like peanut butter on velvet, not joe buck's.

by mrbendy on Sep 10, 2009 8:38 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Landing just several inches over, around where RJ's stride lands him,

would do a lot of good. I’m not sure what to say about that arm action, however.

"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus

by hazel on Sep 10, 2009 9:39 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah,

that front end at follow-through is cause for nightmares.

How is it that MLB coaches not see this and/or allow it to continue? That’s what I would like to know.

ken korach's voice is like peanut butter on velvet, not joe buck's.

by mrbendy on Sep 10, 2009 9:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Pitchers get injured all the time,

if they screw them up without injuring them, that’s when it’s more likely to cost them their job. It’s also possible that they try, but fail to make any strides on a guy’s mechanics.

"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus

by hazel on Sep 10, 2009 10:04 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

this is true.

ken korach's voice is like peanut butter on velvet, not joe buck's.

by mrbendy on Sep 10, 2009 10:09 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

They tried to change his mechanics last year in low A

And he struggled to start the season, then he went back to his highschool delivery and dominated. It is possible however, that the improvement was just him adjusting anyways or the weather heating up. Either way I think he needs to clean up that follow through. If the deception comes from the closed stride then it is tough to get rid of that however.

Jared Weavers 88-92 plays like 90-95 because of his deception. Deception matters, think Brian Fuentes when you think Madison. Fuentes tops out at 91-92 but reaction times are as if he throws mid 90’s

by Nerobe on Sep 22, 2009 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The way he takes the ball back reminds me of Brett Cecil. I might be wrong.

Fire Jim Leyland

And now at Beyond the Boxscore and Project Prospect!

by Mike Rogers on Sep 10, 2009 1:00 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I have never liked Bumgarner as much as some

http://4parl.wordpress.com/ Check it out!

by Markakis and Wieters 4 Life on Sep 13, 2009 8:33 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

His delivery reminds me of Lenny Dinardo’s in that they both position their hands to throw cutters or create cutting action off closed front sides. It so happens that Dinardo also experienced a big loss of velocity. In his early days at Stetson, he used to throw in the low-90s but in his case, the velocity loss came after arm surgery. Maybe Bumgarner’s velocity loss is a dead arm phase as has been speculated. I wonder if it’s also related to perhaps an increased regimen of breaking balls because he hardly threw any in high school as his father wanted to protect his arm. If the Giants are directing him to work on his breaking pitches, then maybe it’s strain that’s sapping his velocity. If I was a Giants fan, i would be worry if the velocity hasn’t bounced back by the beginning of next season.

by Galeto on Sep 17, 2009 2:15 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs